The ‘TikTok Pastor’ sits for a more in-depth interview

The Rev. Bethany Peerbolte is the most recent guest on ‘Leading Theologically’

by Mike Ferguson | Presbyterian News Service

The Rev. Bethany Peerbolte (Photo by Andrew Niven Jowett)

LOUISVILLE — It turns out the Rev. Bethany Peerbolte, known to many as the “TikTok Pastor,” can communicate via longform media as well.

Monday saw the release of the most recent edition of “Leading Theologically,” hosted by the Rev. Bill Davis, Senior Director for Theological Funds Development at the Presbyterian Foundation. Listen to the engaging 20-minute conversation between Peerbolte and Davis here.

Both Peerbolte and Davis are members of Denver Presbytery. Peerbolte told Davis she began making TikToks as a youth pastor “to reach my youth, and people just really connected with the message. The idea of a progressive pastor was new to them. Even a female pastor was new to some people.”

Her most recent online endeavor is called Our Tapestry. “We’re trying to get the church experience to people in theological deserts who don’t have a progressive church around them,” Peerbolte said, “or they’ve been hurt by the church and walking into a church building feels very dangerous to them.”

“I love that testimony of journeying alongside somebody experiencing a dark night of the soul,” Davis told her. “This is what we are trained to do as pastors.”

“You have to find different ways to be comforting,” Peerbolte replied. Using social media, “I can be there at the hour they need a good word.”

Like Davis, “I didn’t get digital ministry training” in seminary, Peerbolte said. “On TikTok, I learned the language and the culture — how jokes develop, how you say just enough so people get the hook.” To Peerbolte, a 15-second video “is the new parable. You tell them just enough to get their brain going but not enough to tell them what the answer is.”

“This is a mission field,” she says about her online engagement. “I have to figure out what people are going through before I can start talking about Jesus.”

“You dove in and then started ministering to folks there,” Davis told her.

“I have learned more about God’s love through social media,” Peerbolte said. “It is really a platform where God speaks. We talk about [social media] algorithms — that’s the Holy Spirit, and the only one who understands algorithms is the Holy Spirit. It’s a place that’s pretty accessible to everyone.”

“The other thing is everyone has a voice. You have a platform, a way to speak your truth and challenge each other — which I think the Kingdom of God is going to be like, having your voice heard. The Spirit has a really good way of getting things that people need to hear to them. Whether it’s the algorithm or the Spirit, it’s amazing how many times a week I hear, ‘Thank you. I really needed to hear this,’ or ‘I’ve been saving this video for later.’ The videos, the jokes, the stories — whatever — find people who need to hear them in that way.”

“I love it that you’re pointing to the Spirit blowing in your ministry,” Davis said before asking Peerbolte to point listeners to others who offer similar models.

“The reason I started making videos is that people were doing it so poorly,” Peerbolte said. “There was a lot of manipulation, a lot of faces crying right up in the screen, saying, ‘I need you to know Jesus.’ That doesn’t have to be the way people fall in love with the gospel. You don’t need fear and manipulation to make people believe that they need God.”

In fact, “there are tons of progressive pastors out there doing this,” she said, adding they can be found by searching Instagram, YouTube, Facebook or TikTok for “#progressiveclergy.”

At disorganized.religion, Pastor Sarah “does little skits. It’s story- and narrative-based. Others are theology-based,” Peerbolte said. “Brandan Robertson does a great job of getting straight to the point, no questions asked, ‘God loves you’ kind of stuff.”

Organizations including churches also produce quality content, Peerbolte said, but their task is more difficult because “social media is about a person developing a relationship with someone.” The Rev. Jim Keat “does a great job with The Riverside Church.”

“If you know the story of your community — why you exist and what your goal is — that’s your personality,” she said.

When Davis asked her about Our Tapestry, Peerbolte said the biggest thing about digital ministry is “community can happen even though you’re not in the same room together.” She believes every pastor should be scrolling for an hour a day “to learn the things you like” so that “you can make content like that. That’s the best way to get your toe in the water.”

“You can use stuff you already have,” Peerbolte said. “You’re doing a sermon on Sunday; here’s a quick preview” or “here’s an interesting takeaway from Bible study. You can put last week’s sermon on Opus and it will cut it down to a 15-second video. Then you’ve got content for the week.”

As for Artificial Intelligence, “It is fascinating and a lifesaver, but terrifying to me,” Peerbolte said.

“It can make wonderful opening lines for your email so people will actually read it. It can do some creepy things too,” she said. “As long as we keep our humanity and realize it’s not a human being talking back to us, that’s where we can start interacting with AI.”

The Rev. Bill Davis

Davis asked Peerbolte what she wishes church leaders knew about the use of social media in their ministry.

Two things, Peerbolte said. First, “there are so many hurting people out there,” people who “desperately need a pastor to say, ‘I love you and God loves you. You don’t have to change. Your queerness is God-created.’”

“The other thing is the reason why there are so many hurting people is because of people in churches,” Peerbolte said. “Most people aren’t walking away from God. They’re walking away from a community of people who have hurt them.”

“If we’re trying to placate everyone and saying, ‘OK, let’s not have the church get smaller’ … that’s what’s increasing mistrust in the church,” she said. “We are not holding each other accountable to what the gospel has told us to do.”

“That’s a word for each and every one of us about the way we show up in the world and engage one another,” Davis said. “Not just face-to-face or not just when we are physically present, but when we are present online as well. That’s a powerful word,” he told Peerbolte. “Thank you.”

Peerbolte concluded by sharing some thoughts about the James Atwood Institute for Congregational Courage, offered this summer by Presbyterian Peace Fellowship and partners at Ghost Ranch Education & Retreat Center. The keynoter was Father John Dear, a priest, peace activist, author and lecturer.

“He was talking about self-nonviolence, and that has been a mind-twister for me,” Peerbolte said. “We talk a lot about self-love and self-care, but I think self-nonviolence is a more reachable goal. You don’t like who you’ve been or where you’ve been or what’s happened to you, but could you at least be nonviolent toward yourself?”

“He also talked about in a world that tells us we have to break other people’s bodies for our peace, we have a God that breaks their own body and pours out their own blood for our peace,” she said, adding she shared communion recently “and I saw it in a completely new way.”

“I had not been involved in gun violence prevention. I now have an understanding of what we’re up against,” Peerbolte said. “Going into a space where you’re not the smartest person has always paid off for me.”